Do you disapprove of bull fighting?!

M.S. Islam · Aug 22, 2012

Vintersorg said:
As I said, it's just a moral point of view. In some cultures, cannibalism is perfectly acceptable. (I couldn't bear the thought of eating another human, though)

That's your values, why wouldn't you respect others' values and traditions?

Murder has to be punished, obviously. But slaughtering an animal for food, or murdering someone is not killing for food.

So cannibalism is okay by YOU, on principle?

Now please enlighten me: why is a human being superior to an animal?
Religious reasons?

I don't see any animal posting in this forum. When that happens, I'll withdraw my superiority 'claim'.

Vintersorg · Aug 22, 2012

paleologos said:
I agree with the first part.

Why is human superior to an animal? Human nature?

Why does that make his life worth more than that of an animal?
That's pure arrogance.

Vintersorg · Aug 22, 2012

M.S. Islam said:
That's your values, why wouldn't you respect others' values and traditions?

Because there doing it for fun...which is unnecessary and cruel

M.S. Islam said:
So cannibalism is okay by YOU, on principle?

You're twisting my words.
The origin of the cannibalism of certain tribes can probably be traced back to necessity for survival. Afterwards, the "habit" persisted.

M.S. Islam said:
I don't see any animal posting in this forum. When that happens, I'll withdraw my superiority 'claim'.

So we're superior and our lives are worth more, because we happen to have invented stuff and because we are more intelligent?
I've seen people with cruel and vain mentalities post here, who were worth far less than even the "lowliest" animal. (luckily they've been banned...)

M.S. Islam · Aug 22, 2012

Vintersorg said:
You're twisting my words.
The origin of the cannibalism of certain tribes can probably be traced back to necessity for survival. Afterwards, the "habit" persisted.

No I am not twisting anything, you specifically emphasized 'need for food',

Vintersorg said:
Murder has to be punished, obviously. But slaughtering an animal for food, or murdering someone is not killing for food.

So we're superior and our lives are worth more, because we happen to have invented stuff and because we are more intelligent?
I've seen people with cruel and vain mentalities post here, who were worth far less than even the "lowliest" animal. (luckily they've been banned...)

That the 'people with cruel and vain mentalities' are getting banned is also another answer to your rather childish question.

Vintersorg · Aug 22, 2012

M.S. Islam said:
No I am not twisting anything, you specifically emphasized 'need for food',

yes, human beings are omnivores by nature.

M.S. Islam said:
That the 'people with cruel and vain mentalities' are getting banned is also another answer to your rather childish question.

So that still doesn't answer my question why a humans' life is worth more than an animals' life?
religious reasons maybe?

paleologos · Aug 22, 2012

Vintersorg said:
Why does that make his life worth more than that of an animal?
That's pure arrogance.

Why is it arrogance? If I was living in the forest and say a bull for whatever reason would charge me and I would kill it would it not make me superior?

Killing bulls for sport on the other hand still permeates criticism depending where you live and which culture you live in. If killing bulls is all you have known do you think you would have the same assessment ?

Vintersorg · Aug 22, 2012

paleologos said:
Why is it arrogance? If I was living in the forest and say a bull for whatever reason would charge me and I would kill it would it not make me superior?

Killing bulls for sport on the other hand still permeates criticism depending where you live and which culture you live in. If killing bulls is all you have known do you think you would have the same assessment ?

That would be self-defense, not unnecessary killing...
When I say superior, I mean: why do some people think that our lives are worth more than that of an animal?

paleologos · Aug 22, 2012

Vintersorg said:
That would be self-defense, not unnecessary killing...
When I say superior, I mean: why do some people think that our lives are worth more than that of an animal?

Depends how you quantify worth I guess....

Vintersorg · Aug 22, 2012

paleologos said:
Depends how you quantify worth I guess....

My points were referring to when Dagul said:
"Human rights tradition is superior than animal rights."

M.S. Islam · Aug 22, 2012

Vintersorg said:
yes, human beings are omnivores by nature.

Now you are twisting things. You said,

Human life=animal life, &
Killing animal for FOOD is okay.

Therefore, killing humans for FOOD [CANNIBALISM] is also okay by you. [Q.E.D]

So that still doesn't answer my question why a humans' life is worth more than an animals' life?
religious reasons maybe?

Common sense. Religion, too. There ain't much to separate the two.

Vintersorg · Aug 22, 2012

M.S. Islam said:
Now you are twisting things. You said,

Human life=animal life, &
Killing animal for FOOD is okay.

Therefore, killing humans for FOOD [CANNIBALISM] is also okay by you. [Q.E.D]

I don't see where I'm twisting things.
Cannibalism might be perfectly acceptable depending on the culture.

M.S. Islam said:
Common sense. Religion, too. There ain't much to separate the two.

So you think that because it's common sense? You haven't got any factual evidence to back that up? any scientific findings that unconditionnally proves animal lives to be worth less than that of a human?
As for religion, sorry, that's definitely not a valid viewpoint. Just because some bronze age goatherders thought they were worth more than the average animal, that doesn't mean I'm going to believe it.

M.S. Islam · Aug 22, 2012

Vintersorg said:
I don't see where I'm twisting things.
Cannibalism might be perfectly acceptable depending on the culture.

Cannibalism is perfectly acceptable if that's as per culture, but bull-fighting is not acceptable even if that's as per culture!! You are a confused individual.

So you think that because it's common sense? You haven't got any factual evidence to back that up? any scientific findings that unconditionnally proves animal lives to be worth less than that of a human?

That's a philosophical question, not a scientific one. Humans have the highest bodymass-brainsize ratio, however.

As for religion, sorry, that's definitely not a valid viewpoint. Just because some bronze age goatherders thought they were worth more than the average animal, that doesn't mean I'm going to believe it.

You were driving towards this all along, weren't you? I call that baiting.

okamido · Aug 22, 2012

I'd be more impressed with the bullfighters if they didn't bleed the bull out before the contest.

As it stands, the only redeemable ting about bullfighting is when the bullfighter gets ....d.

Vintersorg · Aug 22, 2012

M.S. Islam said:
Cannibalism is perfectly acceptable if that's as per culture, but bull-fighting is not acceptable even if that's as per culture!! You are a confused individual.

No. Cannibalism is done for food.
Bull-fighting is for pleasure.

M.S. Islam said:
That's a philosophical question, not a scientific one. Humans have the highest bodymass-brainsize ratio, however.

So they're free to behave like idiots towards animals?

M.S. Islam said:
You were driving towards this all along, weren't you? I call that baiting.

Not really. I actually said it more out of annoyance. I can see why it offended you, and I apologise for my harsh words.

stormcrow · Aug 22, 2012

My mother always said, " Don't play with your food".

M.S. Islam · Aug 22, 2012

Vintersorg said:
No. Cannibalism is done for food.
Bull-fighting is for pleasure.

If you think cannibalism is okay, then you are an amoral person. I am sorry if that offended you.

So they're free to behave like idiots towards animals?

No, bull fighting is unacceptable to me, which I have made clear in the first comment. I also believe spaniards are perfectly entitled to pursue their culture of bull-fighting. So, what's that you are contending for?

M.S. Islam · Aug 22, 2012

FYI, taking good care of animals is an Islamic teaching. Bull-fighting would be against Islamic principles, too.

unclefred · Aug 22, 2012

I've only been to one, in Cancun, I found it a mix of excitement and sadness. The first thing the bull did was charge the armored horse and knocked it up in the air quite vigorously. Although he did bleed some from the picador and the darts of the banderillas, I woudn't say it was much. The idea of the picador lancing the hump is to weaken the neck muscles so the bulls head will hang slightly lower allowing for a clean final thrust by the Matador.

They have a restaurant at the arena that serves very tasty beef!

kbear · Aug 22, 2012

i must admit, i'm rooting for the bull also. any "sport" that involves killing an animal for the entertainment of a bunch of blood thirsty morons should be abolished.

Vintersorg · Aug 22, 2012

M.S. Islam said:
If you think cannibalism is okay, then you are an amoral person. I am sorry if that offended you.

So where did you get from "Cannibalism is acceptable in certain cultures" and " Cannibalism is done for food, whereas bull-fighting is done for pleasure" to "you think cannibalism is OK".

M.S. Islam said:
No, bull fighting is unacceptable to me, which I have made clear in the first comment.

good, at last we agree on something. We can build upon that to improve our discussions in the future

M.S. Islam said:
I also believe spaniards are perfectly entitled to pursue their culture of bull-fighting. So, what's that you are contending for?

I never contended that. Let them do it. I'll keep rooting for the bulls and I'll keep on laughing when the Matador gets roughed around by his intended victim.

Search

Search

Do you disapprove of bull fighting?!

M.S. Islam

Vintersorg

Vintersorg

M.S. Islam

Vintersorg

paleologos

Vintersorg

paleologos

Vintersorg

M.S. Islam

Vintersorg

M.S. Islam

okamido

Vintersorg

stormcrow

M.S. Islam

M.S. Islam

unclefred

kbear

Vintersorg

More History Discussions

Recent History Discussions

Trending History Discussions